Greedygrabbygrubbers

[ceebeegee]

Yesterday in Slate, their advice columnist responded, again, to the question of whether a bridal couple should ask for money.

Oh my God. I can't begin to say how completely tacky I think it is to ask for anything, much less money. I just shudder. I know many people give money which bothers me enough because it puts a financial value on what you're giving, in addition to making people who can't afford to give much feel like shit, because of course the couple are going to notice right away who gave more, and less. But to ask? To expect it? I don't have a problem with gift registries as long as they're discreet--not included with the wedding invitations. But money? Too, too tacky. Why don't I just skip the wedding entirely and send a check? That's what you really want, isn't it? I remember one snotty bride writing in to Carolyn Hax saying "if you're invited you have to send a gift, even if you don't go." You have to send a gift? Fuck off, greedy person. Get your hands out of other people's wallets.

This was great:

Good thing times have changed. Most ethnic traditions include monetary gifts at a wedding. In fact, any other type of gift is out of the norm. "Physical" gifts are usually presented by the family IN ADDITION to a monetary gift. I come from an upper middle-class, well-educated family, and we have never gone to a wedding that has not been this way.

Um, not my ethnic tradition. People in the South would faint if people asked for money. And justifying something by claiming to be from an "upper middle-class, well-educated family" is pretty transparent--your argument should speak for itself. My family would disown me if I asked for money at my wedding. And if we're going to get snotty, my family is descended from a Signer. "Times have changed..."--the standard for every attempt to hijack etiquette to suit your own urges.

This was the best:

So they think it's "tacky" to ask for money? Well, we think it's worse to make people spend precious time getting gifts we don't need or want.

You're right! You're so right! So rather than impose, how about telling your guests no gifts are needed at all? Oh but wait, that would cut into your "take." And I love the reasoning of "we're older, we have everything we need already." Bingo. So, you don't NEED anything. Why are you asking for something then? Or rather, expecting anything? What is it about weddings that turn some people into grabbing, entitlement-minded monsters? Ugh. Just UGH.

Comments

[ceebeegee.livejournal.com]

I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting or needing money, or hoping for it, especially because it's certainly a custom for some people to give it. Where I draw the line is asking for it, expecting it, demanding it. It leaves a very bad taste in my mouth. It turns the whole thing into a financial transaction, especially that formula of "pay as much as they're spending on your plate at the reception" (sorry, Mike!). First of all, how are you supposed to calculate that? Especially if you don't even know until you get to the reception, at which point most people have already bought the gift. And what if you got a great deal on the wedding gift--are you supposed to fork over the remainder for the couple as well? And most importantly, what about the poor friends you may have? One year I was invited to 7 weddings, of which I was in 4 (either bridesmaid, MOH or singer). I got so panicky I had to decline a couple--I couldn't afford much of anything that year. If someone had told me I was obliged to give a gift even if I didn't go to ceremony, I would've hung up on them. Luckily my friends are nicer than that. I had to give some of them presents almost a year later--I held a mass "reverse wedding shower," wherein I presented four brides with presents which they all found amusing. But then there was the bridal shower (also that year) wherein I had to give a plant because I couldn't afford ANYTHING more. Again, my friend was really nice but I did get some looks from the older women there.

It just really bothers me seeing what should be a joyous occasion turned into this mass grab, this commercial venture. Stop calculating what people are spending and just be happy they're there. It should not be about the presents.

[minstrel70.livejournal.com]

My "formula" was intended to be approximate. Most weddings run between $50-100 / plate. I try to always give a gift in that range or higher. More, if I bring a date.

I suppose it's a silly formula I read somewhere, that stuck with me. But it does provide a useful guideline, I think.

[ceebeegee.livejournal.com]

Oh no, I've heard it too. I first heard it when this girl with whom I was doing a show was complaining about the quality of gifts at her wedding. She cited that formula and my jaw dropped. Just...wow. It's not a bad guideline but again, I draw the line as a requirement, a demand. It's just so crass.

[minstrel70.livejournal.com]

Oh, I wholeheartedly agree with you on that point. It's as rude as comparing the value of Christmas gifts exchanged. And it doesn't take into account what someone can afford.

Then again, there's where it can really get ugly: a friend of mine complained (behind my back) that the $100 check I sent for her wedding, which I did not even attend, wasn't sufficient given my income. Seriously. I haven't so much talked to her since I heard that...

[ceebeegee.livejournal.com]

Oh. Oh, wow. No words.

[wonderpanther.livejournal.com]

The "formula" really depends on where the wedding is given. I would say that the "standard" monetary gift from a decently close friend in the NYC Metro Area is presently $200-$250. In upstate NY, it is $100-$150.

[minstrel70.livejournal.com]

Oh, hell.. So I'm a cheap bastard stepchild of the '80s and Midwest then? Can one retroactively gift someone? I've never given more than, say, $150 (per person, of course) in cash or kind. And suddenly I feel guilty.

I dare say my obnoxious (ex-) friend, who found $100 a little slim, would take your standard, adjust for income, and find me in contempt for a gift of less than $500.

Yet I've never been accused of being cheap, save for the one I mentioned earlier.

[minstrel70.livejournal.com]

Actually, skip my last comment. $200-250, as an expectation, is obscene. And I don't care if the wedding is in the NYC metro, or in the hinterlands of Kentucky. Suddenly I'm completely with Clara on this one. Maybe it's just because I'm feeling oppressive guilt at being a cheap SOB lately.

[ceebeegee.livejournal.com]

You are not a cheap SOB. After The Year of Seven Weddings, where I felt horrible at bringing a plant to a bridal shower, for a bride in whose wedding I was singing (and you should've seen the stuff she got at that shower--THREE fully stocked picnic baskets--it's all a competition), I swore if I ever get married, I will personally seek out my friends and tell them "Only get me a gift if it really means something to us, or if you made it or something. If you're bringing a gift because you feel you have to, don't bother--I'd rather see your ass. Make me perfume or cross-stitch me something. I don't need a flippin' blender." I will fully cop to liking my "things" and in that sense, being materialistic--but I indulge my own materialism. I am a terrible gift-giver because to me, what's really important is spending quality time with someone.

Hay-seuss. $250. It's all a big racket. No wonder people get married for all the wrong reasons, with that kind of pressure. They want some return on their investment!

[mysticblaze.livejournal.com]

It is easy to become a great gift-giver as long as you listen to what your prospective donee has to say (particularly if you are spending a lot of time with him or her)... most often, the donee will tell you what he or she wants without actually realizing it. The donee does not have to know how much you spent (if anything), or where you got it from, as long as it is something that he or she will enjoy. It is the thought that counts, and seeing that you were paying attention to what was said is usually enough. You will know when the donee pauses as he or she looks at the gift, and then at you, in disbelief and awe.

BTW- after having read parts of your journal, I would assume that a good gift for you would be a toy for Tatiana or a bottle of apple schnappes...

The same principle applies to the soon to be married couple, but it takes extra work, since you have to listen to both persons and extrapolate something that they both want. But it can be done, and inexpensively at that. It does require taking the time and shopping around for the best deal.

[wonderpanther.livejournal.com]

I want to amend in saying that the numbers I gave are generally a "per couple" amount.

[wonderpanther.livejournal.com]

I agree with you. Here are some of the absolute best gifts Seth and I got:

1) A serving bowl from a local potter and 2 shirts from the Coffee Messiah in Seattle...we can't wear them in publich as they might offend but they rock.
2) A Rainy Day Fun kit that featured a wine rack, a bottle of wine, a motown CD and a board game.
3) 6 bottles of wine all hand decorated by my friends with paint and stickers for specific occasions including "A Night by the Fire" and "A Starry Night" and two hand decorated wione glasses.