Deal breakers

[ceebeegee]

Interesting article about "deal breakers."

I have a problem with the slant of this article--that women are the only gender who have deal breakers. In fact that was a running joke on Seinfeld about how inexlicably picky he and George were. And I think the concept of deal breakers is ill-defined. Any woman would be pissed at some of the behavior portrayed. Like "There's the dumb remark, as in 'I guess I should have told you I was a drug dealer.' Or: 'Do you know you have cellulite on your legs?' " I mean, duh!

But then this pissed me off, on behalf of the guys:

Who pays for a date can also be a big deal. Two generations ago, the man was expected to. A generation later, women paid their own way. Today, many young ladies silently embrace the notion that the guy should pay if he can afford it -- but guys don't seem to have caught on.

Fuck that. I cannot stand women who expect that. I saw a Today show segment about that a few years ago and my head exploded--the would-be princesses dissing any man who didn't pay. Fuck. That. Men are not banks, and women are not princesses. We are all adults. And not to mention, money comes with strings attached sometimes.

OTOH, this also pissed me off:

Chanel Hill, a GW junior, was pursued in high school by a guy whom she finally agreed to go out with once she got to college. He asked her to dinner, assuring her "You won't have to pay for a thing." They took the Metro to Union Station, dined at Johnny Rocket's, laughed over old times. Then the bill came. "It lay on the table for 10, 15, then 20 minutes," Hill recalls. "I went to the bathroom and when I came back, it was still there." Finally, the young man asked, "Chanel, what are you going to contribute?"

Dude. If you offer to pay, you should pay. A guy once asked me out, named the restaurant (and it wasn't cheap) and then asked for a contribution at the end--and I was pretty poor at the time. He did pay most of it but I thought that was very poor form. If I'd known he wanted a contribution, I would've suggested a less expensive restaurant.

But then, again OTOH, this infuriated me:

Some of her girlfriends expect to be spoiled, she says. Kalinger, though, doesn't like expensive gifts. When a boy she had been seeing for two weeks gave her a diamond heart necklace from Tiffany & Co., she cut loose. But she kept the necklace.

Sooooooooooo tacky. Unbelievably poor form. You kept a Tiffany diamond heart necklace??? And dumped the guy? I'm just shaking my head at that. I can't believe her mother let her do that.

Comments

[foulpost.livejournal.com]

I can see your point, and true online dating is populated by mostly males. I don't really do it anymore, at least not actively. On some sites though you may be surprised at the close ratio. I have encountered a lot of women who clearly want a guy who makes a lot of money and works for some corporate anagram. I think the point I really wanted to make was the last thing I wrote. I really do thing women graviate toward guys who treat them like shit. Sometimes I joke that I wish I could just be a complete prick because then perhaps things would be simpler.

[mollyx.livejournal.com]

It would be simpler.
But you wouldn't be you. You wouldn't be happy, and you would be known as a prick. Some women are under the impression that they can change these prick men. For the rest, I can't explain. I never understood the attraction of lousy men. Well, men who started out lousy, anyway. Two of mine just ended up that way.

[mysticblaze.livejournal.com]

The attraction to lousy men sometimes comes from a phenomenon similar or as a part of the "cycle of violence". A girl grows up with a lousy male role model (whether it be a parental unit or the many "uncles" that some women bring around their kids) and all she sees around her are other lousy male role models, so when she decides to date, she will look for the same type of man and will subject herself to his behaviour because that is what she has observed in the past. Once she disassociates herself from one, she is more than likely to look for another of the same ilk to replace him. Unless she is able to see the pattern that she is propagating, she is not going to change.

yea, what she said...

[mollyx.livejournal.com]

Stupid, isn't it?

Re: yea, what she said...

[mysticblaze.livejournal.com]

Yes, it is. However, most of those women have low self esteem to begin with, and the lousy men feed off of it and remind them of it constantly. The situation becomes a zillion times worse when there is abuse involved.

[ceebeegee.livejournal.com]

I think it's a false dichotomy that all men are either nice guys or assholes. Sometimes a nice guy is actually a nice guy, and sometimes he's a clingy, desperate loser with no social skills. Sometimes an asshole is actually that, and sometimes he's a guy with a healthy sense of "let's just have fun."

I won't deny that there are unfortunately women who seem to thrive on abuse--I hate that shit, it pisses me off and makes me want to shake them. I'm just saying sometimes the argument about nice guys and assholes gets muddled. From personal experience, I'm always getting waylaid by guys (whom I don't or barely know) who accuse me of "ignoring" them and freely calling me a bitch because I didn't seek them out to be friendly. (Yes, this has happened to me on more occasions than I care to remember and once a guy said this preparatory to asking me out, if you can believe it. Yeah, that's a winning tactic--"You're such a bitch for ignoring me--let's date!") From their perspective, I'm the "asshole."

[minstrel70.livejournal.com]

What about a nice guy with a healthy sense of "let's just have fun?"

I wonder if the seeming improbability of that combination has something to do with why nice guys finish last.

[ceebeegee.livejournal.com]

A nice guy with a sense of humor plus a strong sense of who he is--is the ne plus ultra of the hetero female dating world. A guy who can laugh at himself without it being a cover for his own insecurity is just--soooo hot. This is why Harrison Ford is so dreamy.